The Business of Healing with Krista Michener
Business as UNusual Ep 5 - Season 3 Transcript
[00:00:00] Aicila: Hi, welcome to business is unusual. This is Isla and I'm here today with Krista. I'm very excited to have you on the show, Krista.
[00:00:07] Krista: Thank you. Me too.
[00:00:08] Aicila: Before we dive in to the nitty gritty of the awesome work that you're doing what's the last thing that you did for fun?
[00:00:16] Krista: The last thing that I did for fun on Christmas Day, I have six children all. are very different. Some of them are typical teenagers and don't like to spend time with their family. But I was able somehow to get them all to come together to do something. We went to see the boys in the boat and eat Chinese food because I didn't want to cook.
[00:00:38] Krista: And I had a lot of fun. And they actually all came. So, it was awesome.
[00:00:43] Krista: Yeah.
[00:00:44] Aicila: That sounds
[00:00:44] Krista: was. It was really nice. My son with autism actually only was in the theater for the beginning and the end because he doesn't like that type of movie, but he was in a bar and ate snacks, so he was still with [00:01:00] us..
[00:01:00] Aicila: So I am so excited for you to tell people a little bit about what your business is and what we're going to talk about today.
[00:01:06] Krista: So I am a nurse practitioner. I was a registered nurse for, I think about 16 years before I went back to school. Got a job in primary care family practice did that for about three years, but was really disturbed by Seeing people who did not take care of their health until something catastrophic happened.
[00:01:32] Krista: Sometimes it was because of finances. Sometimes it was just because our healthcare world does business, you know, 8 or 9 to 5 when a lot of people are at work. And not everyone has the luxury of having a job that they can just take off. We have a lot of people in my community. who are in manufacturing.
[00:01:51] Krista: You know, you get, you're penalized for being sick, you're penalized for being off the line. And I, it just was really disturbing. I [00:02:00] it really was a form of inspiration, though, to open this. For a long time, every morning, I pray in my closet, and for a long period of time, I kept having this thought, you need to open a practice over in this building where I am.
[00:02:11] Krista: And I'm like, That's crazy. And I told my husband, he goes, you're gonna think I'm crazy. And he said, yeah, you're right. You're crazy. Don't we have enough going on? But, but it, the space became available. So originally, my thought was just providing like low cost quality care at convenient hours. So like I'm open every Thursday till eight.
[00:02:32] Krista: I'm open every Saturday. One of the Upsides of COVID is that telehealth is a lot more accepted now and that technology is more available. But then as things evolved that it wasn't really taking off the way that I hoped it would. And I realized the part of what I did that people really liked and seemed to be hungry for was.
[00:02:57] Krista: What's called integrative health where it's [00:03:00] not all natural or all Western medicine like you take the both the best of both worlds and a lot of people
[00:03:06] Krista: to choose. And I really feel like there is good and both approaches, it just depends on the situation. And I also realized, interestingly, that I always thought people who didn't have insurance, it was just because they couldn't afford it.
[00:03:21] Krista: But we have a lot of people in my community, a big part of them, we have the largest Amish community in the United States is in this area, so they don't have insurance by choice, but then we have a lot of, it's a rural area, a lot of people who just say, I'm self employed, I'm a farmer, I'm whatever.
[00:03:41] Krista: Why would I pay all this money for insurance that's not even going to let me get the type of care I want to get,
[00:03:47] Krista: you know, I'll just, so they belong to cost sharing programs that will kick in and emergencies, but they just, they don't want to spend a lot of money on a system that provides. care that doesn't really align with their [00:04:00] values.
[00:04:00] Krista: And I realized there are people who are paying cash for their health care because they want to spend their money at a place that aligns with how they like to be cared for. And interestingly, we, I have a fair number of patients who also have private insurance or Medicare or Medicaid, and they and they still choose to come here because they like how we practice.
[00:04:22] Krista: So one thing that a lot of people don't realize and that I didn't realize before I was a provider is that, you'll hear people get upset because they don't take insurance or they don't this. The insurance company makes the rules and really it's Medicare that makes the rules. So if I accepted insurance for my visit, say it was Medicare rates were 160, and so I billed Medicare 160, but they really actually were only going to reimburse me 100 because they don't reimburse full amounts.
[00:04:54] Krista: If I said Sally over here doesn't have insurance, so I'm just going to charge her 100, they'd say, hey, that's [00:05:00] insurance fraud. You can't charge them something different when you're charging us. Even though they're not paying that. There, there are a lot of things, and on the flip side too, there are a lot of practices who don't accept self pay at all.
[00:05:14] Krista: I've had friends who have gone to try to get healthcare other places and said I have cash, I'll pay cash, time of visit. They're like, nope, we only do insurance. It is really hard to please everyone, and I really don't think you can. You can't really be a practice that does both. And one of the things that I've realized, too, is by not accepting insurance, and you still if you have insurance, it'll still pay for your labs, your prescriptions, those sorts of things.
[00:05:42] Krista: Insurance dictates the care you provide. If I accept Medicare, and I don't have a certain percentage of my Medicare patients with diabetes, On three specific medications, metformin, astatin, and then either like lisinopril or [00:06:00] losartan for blood pressure, they'll reduce my reimbursement
[00:06:02] Krista: rates. you
[00:06:04] Aicila: That makes total
[00:06:05] Aicila: sense.
[00:06:06] Krista: yeah and you get paid more for prescribing more, ordering more tests.
[00:06:11] Krista: Like, there are a lot of perverse financial incentives to provide unnecessary care. And I just. It was I mean it wasn't it was very affirming reading through your content about aligning with your values because I realized even though I have this internal struggle, because I don't like the business money part of it, like I don't like it and I don't like charging people and I don't like that healthcare is not as inexpensive as some people would like it to be because of all of the fees that we have.
[00:06:45] Krista: I mean it's just, We can get into that later, but my values of being able to have quality time with my patients that isn't rushed about being able to provide like individualized care and eliminate unnecessary things like This [00:07:00] is the context that allows me to do that. Outside of this framework, I don't have that freedom.
[00:07:04] Aicila: , as a patient, that bothered me, honestly, from the time I was a teenager. You know, you'd be with a doctor and the first thing they would do is figure out what your insurance covered. And I'm like, no, I want to figure out what I need. What's the, what's the best care that you think I need to thrive? And then let's start making compromises based on that. Not, let's compromise and not even look at things that might be a good fit for you and your situation because your insurance says no.
[00:07:32] Krista: And to grant you the I just the grace and respect that you can make good decisions about your health. That you have the ability to do that, because one other thing that I've learned through this is how insurance really jacks up prices. I don't know if you've seen GoodRx, the little app you can get where you put in, a medication.
[00:07:54] Krista: You put in, I live in this area, I want this medication, I have this dose, and I need this [00:08:00] many tablets. And it'll give you a list of prices of different pharmacies. And you can have one medication that there's literally a couple hundred dollar difference. So you can have a medication where I can go to CVS or I can go to the other pharmacy down the road and there's a couple hundred dollar difference
[00:08:20] Krista: Price. I used to think medicine was a lot more like gas maybe there would be a couple of cents difference, but not, not hundreds of dollars.
[00:08:32] Krista: And sometimes it's cheaper to pay cash than to pay your insurance price. We help people work around that not just what's your insurance, but How much does this med cost? Where do you live? If we send it to Drug Mart, you can save
[00:08:45] Krista: 60
[00:08:46] Krista: on
[00:08:46] Krista: that. That takes time though, helping people find
[00:08:49] Krista: ways
[00:08:50] Krista: to afford
[00:08:50] Krista: things.
[00:08:51] Aicila: Yeah. I mean, that's what I've always wanted medicine to be. And that in a partnership. Like, You have all the information and study [00:09:00] on, you went to school to learn this, and then you have all this practice, and I know me. And so the
[00:09:06] Aicila: two of us, and because, it's, there's also the medical pieces, but there's also pieces, and I get,, there's an ideal way to do things, and then there's what's actually going to work family.
[00:09:16] Krista: Right.
[00:09:17] Aicila: And, there's no use in having some ideal never live up to.
[00:09:20] Krista: Able to do. Because you've got the financial piece, people's values, their past experience. And I remember being shocked the first time someone said if I don't take, X medication, are you going to fire me? I'm like, no why would I do that?
[00:09:36] Krista: But that had happened to them with another provider. They didn't want to take a specific diabetes medication. So they said, we won't take care of you. And I have only fired two patients. This is for being abusive toward my staff. So that's, I'm not going to fire you because you don't, because what I recommend is not going to be the same for each person.
[00:09:56] Krista: It's going to be based on What are your values? What are your [00:10:00] finances? What's your past experience? And what's practical? I remember one of the best things I did was as an RN I did home care for a while and that was really eye opening because you had on one end doctors who are writing orders and then you see what it's like for someone to carry that out in their home and I'm like You've got these little ladies who weigh 90 pounds with COPD and you're prescribing all these inhalers and their hands are shaking and they can't coordinate to Press the puffer to get the air, like what's the impact of these regimens and how realistic it is It was really good to then be able to take the framework with everything.
[00:10:35] Krista: I recommend what's this? You know What are you likely to do? There's some people who I know I'm lucky if I'm going to get them to do things once a day So I wouldn't be an idiot and describe something that they have to take two to three times a day because I know once a day is a big deal and we're just going to work on making that practical,
[00:10:53] Aicila: Yeah. Well, and I also of, um, I'm not great at always noticing [00:11:00] when I'm not well. Like I have, know, I think lots of women have that, but I, I learned that about myself and I had a series of strep infections several years ago. And the doctor was going to prescribe this very intense antibiotic. And they were like, well, you'll have to notice if you start to feel this, because it can mean it's damaging your tendons. And I said, then you've got to find something else, because I not notice that until it has. Like, I just, I know this about myself. I would love that not to be true. And he kind of looked at me like Seriously?
[00:11:29] Aicila: And I'm just like, no, really. You're opening a can of worms here. I'll come back with tendon issues and I'll still have strep. So And I get it. Like, I agree. Wouldn't it be great if that was not true? I'm working on it, but I've been working on it for a long time. Hasn't changed much. Let's not roll those dice today.
[00:11:47] Krista: Right.
[00:11:48] Aicila: You know? I'm not trying to be difficult. I'm just being
[00:11:50] Aicila: aware.
[00:11:52] Krista: Honest, and that's really helpful. We have I actually designed this thing recently. It's called the Pillars of Healing. And it's, [00:12:00] I don't know if I have one in front of me here, but it's the four I's. So one of them, because we do a lot with chronic infections like Lyme disease and Bartonella, those sorts of things, and a lot of people just want to take a pill and get better.
[00:12:11] Krista: Just You know, they want things simple, but you have to, we have the infection, we have building your immune system, reducing inflammation, and then the last one is integrity, because you have to be honest with yourself, you have to be honest with your provider or it's not going to work, because I have some people who are just not honest with themselves and I have some people who I know are lying to me, which is kind of a waste of your time and money because I can't help you very much if we can't be straightforward about what you're experiencing, what you're actually doing or not doing, you're just not going to get well unless you have the And I think, you may feel like you're not self aware about your body, but you're self aware enough to know that you're not aware.
[00:12:56] Krista: And that's a pretty big
[00:12:58] Krista: deal. That's a pretty [00:13:00] big
[00:13:00] Krista: deal.
[00:13:01] Aicila: Thank you for that. So what does success look like to you? Yeah. Like, is just in your practice, or do you, do you see other people modeling practices similarly or?
[00:13:11] Krista: So I it's got a couple of different facets. If there's not balance, you're going to burn out and you're not going to have anything to give to anyone. So My definition of that has evolved over time. Part of that is I want to have a health home basically where people can come and be supported and healing.
[00:13:31] Krista: We do a lot with chronic illness. I want it to be not completely dependent on me because it has been until this point and there's a lot of pressure in knowing If I get sick or have a family emergency or I'm in a car accident, who's going to see my patients? Who's going to generate revenue so that my employees get paid?
[00:13:51] Krista: That's a lot of stress. So I would like it to be able to be able to function well with or without my presence. I can be [00:14:00] gone for a week and things don't fall apart. And then I also want to have the balance where I'm working, I'm putting in good, honest work, but I've got time with my family, and that, that's a big deal, at the beginning, it's a big investment, financially, my husband's really supportive, we mortgaged our house to do this, I didn't pay myself for over two years and then just a sacrifice of time, obviously, so as we're bringing I'm bringing some new providers on, I would love it if they can Not only add to what we have to offer our patients, but give me some freedom.
[00:14:34] Krista: So if we go out, we went on a vacation for the first time since I opened it this year, but I was still, doing telehealth the whole time we were gone. And I would love to not have to do that.
[00:14:46] Krista: Because in reality, you realize if you don't have that balance, you're not going to be able to take good care of your
[00:14:53] Krista: patients for very
[00:14:54] Krista: long.
[00:14:55] Krista: you're Yeah. It's I, do business development [00:15:00] consulting and, and we're at coaching support teamwork. I don't know how to, it's not really consulting because I don't, I care too much. But one that, I talk about, like I have three values that I really try to implement with all of my clients and people I work with, and one of them is And it's exactly that. Like, My thing if it matters to you today, it's going to matter to you tomorrow. So part of how you spend your energy right now needs to include an understanding. Of tomorrow, and it also needs to include an understanding that your whole person a lot of people that started business like you do do it because they're passionate about something and I.
[00:15:35] Krista: Like I get it. I'm passionate about what I do. don't doesn't feel like work all the time. Even when it feels like work, it doesn't because I'm so I feel so delighted that I get to do this.
[00:15:45] Aicila: And yet, right. and yet at the same time, if I don't take a break, I don't have as much to offer. I'm not enjoying my kids or my friends, my community.
[00:15:54] Aicila: Like There's so many other things that also do. Genuinely bring me joy and recharge me. And so I [00:16:00] feel like that's so wise. Like recognizing that you have to be sustainable as a person. You have to be a whole person in your life. Like that to me is like one of the biggest things that I feel like people who who are solopreneurs or in smaller businesses need to incorporate into themselves is like. exactly that. People talk about work life balance, but I think it's life life balance when you're passionate like that because it's not like you're sitting there wishing you could, like, go home. It's just you would like maybe to
[00:16:28] Aicila: see your husband or hang out with your
[00:16:30] Aicila: kids or take a nap.
[00:16:32] Krista: And be careful to what you offer because you don't, like with health and we have some really sick patients, training patients to be as self sufficient as they can be and that not everything's an emergency and I have had to really back off, at the beginning when we were so small, you could get back to people immediately.
[00:16:52] Krista: And I've had to really back off to not create that expectation because that's not realistic and it's not really [00:17:00] fair to us because the whole time we're here, we're working hard, responding to messages, putting out fires, taking care of things, trying to facilitate care. And somebody has the expectation that I call them and I'll have an instant response.
[00:17:15] Krista: Then they're going to be upset if it takes a day sometimes, and guess what? That's reality. And you have to learn to plan ahead. It's made me a better patient, realizing, Yeah, it's really not fair of me to call when I took my last pill to ask for a refill. That happens sometimes. But I have to plan ahead and be respectful of everything that's going on behind the scenes, because I'm just much more.
[00:17:38] Krista: Into where even then you could say, Oh how long does it take them to go in and send a refill? It takes a good five minutes, and if you've got 20 people who needed that plus so and so's in the hospital, there's just so many different pieces to it, so it's helped me, I think, be a more respectful.
[00:17:55] Krista: I don't, I'd like to think I wasn't a terrible one, but it's made me much [00:18:00] intimately aware of everything that's going
[00:18:02] Krista: on behind the
[00:18:03] Krista: scenes.
[00:18:04] Aicila: Yeah, no, that makes a lot So, We've all, I think, had experiences, especially medical providers, dealing with the medical industry What, wHat's at the stage for you to see this as a need to take that action, right? Like, cause I, I feel like there's, there's experiences and identity.
[00:18:25] Aicila: And we share that with a lot of people, but then the part of you that, that pulled that all together or moment that sort of inspired you to actually, what what is it that, that, that sparked that for you?
[00:18:39] Krista: It was really, that's a good question. It was really a leap of faith. And like I said, that inspiration, that idea that just kept coming to me, you need to do this, you need to do this. And I didn't have a clear vision then. Of what I'm doing now, I saw the first step and I learned as time went [00:19:00] on and there were meetings, not, I don't think they were chance meetings of people who introduced me to one little thing that led me down a path that just opened the door and I think what really drives me now is the idea that with chronic illness, There's always a root cause and there are a lot of people who we've left behind and said there's nothing we can do for you You're gonna be this way forever.
[00:19:25] Krista: And that's a lie. It's a lie, you know I have seen especially with mental health, you know some of what I've gone through and with my kids And I don't even know if you and I have talked about this known you for a long time I had a patient who had She had gotten weaker and weaker over the course of a year.
[00:19:43] Krista: This is before she was my patient, and she had, it lost her ability to walk, and she had been to a prestigious medical center, had a complete workup, and they just came to the conclusion you have ALS. There's nothing we can do, and that's a terminal diagnosis. And it was very unsettling [00:20:00] to me because this lady had been so active and so healthy.
[00:20:04] Krista: And by many measures, I had just read a book. About the role chronic infections can play in chronic disease. Had her tested, she had Borrelia, which is Lyme disease, and Bartonella, which is another infection. I started going to conferences and I thought, this has got to be what's going on with some of my kids.
[00:20:22] Krista: This is, this has got to be what's going on. We have spent tens of thousands of dollars on counselors, medication, hospitalization, all sorts of things. So come to find out that all five of my biological children have Babesia and Bartonella, these two infections spread by bugs, but that I gave it to them through pregnancy.
[00:20:43] Krista: And as we've treated that, I, the medicine I was taking for what has been diagnosed as bipolar disorder, I no longer need, I don't have anxiety anymore, my 21 year old who has autism, and he does, he's quirky. But [00:21:00] after a year of treatment, he's out of his room talking to everyone. He's Mom, I'm just a people person.
[00:21:04] Krista: That was, he's like Mr. Different, my 25
[00:21:08] Krista: year old who had so much difficulty with rage and all of just severe disabling anxiety is. doesn't have rage anymore. My daughter's chronic migraines are gone. Like all of these things have resolved by identifying and treating these infections. And the more I've dug into other things, I have a couple of different people, one in mind particularly a young man who was early 20s and he has bipolar disorder, but he was preoccupied for his parents with his bladder.
[00:21:41] Krista: He was preoccupied with his bladder. They had taken him to a urologist. They did testing. They said there's nothing wrong with him. This is psychosis. We did some more in depth testing and we found a very low level of an infection and we treated it and his quote unquote psychosis is gone. He was preoccupied with his bladder [00:22:00] because he knew something was wrong and it was.
[00:22:02] Krista: It's driving him crazy, so the way he expressed it may have seemed unordinary, but people know their bodies, he knew something was wrong and, the test, the level that came back was very low and some people would not have treated it. Most people wouldn't have, but it shouldn't have been there, and when we treated it.
[00:22:23] Krista: His symptoms went away. So I've just, I'm very driven by the fact my, a tagline has become, you were made to be whole, because I really believe that, there's some things we're not going to figure out in this life and gonna have to live with and we're mortal and things wear out, but there is a lot of chronic illness that, that we can address and we can improve.
[00:22:43] Krista: And if you look at drug development, almost all of it is for chronic disease. Nobody is coming up with a drug to cure diabetes that you won't have to take forever. It's all new expensive drugs to manage your diabetes that you'll have to take for the rest of your [00:23:00] life. And some of them are great medications.
[00:23:02] Krista: I'm not saying that there aren't some good meds out there, but if you look at where all the money goes for development, it is not to cure things. It's to create medications that people will have to take. Forever. And that's disturbing to me. I did not used to be a conspiracy theorist and I don't think I, I am, but I think I've just become much more aware to the role of profit and policy is driving your healthcare versus what's good for you as a person.
[00:23:32] Krista: And so ultimately, even though you may have to on something, spend more of your own money up front in the long run, you're going to have a lot more money and you're going to have your health. Oh, wow.
[00:23:45] Aicila: you on that. Yeah. Yeah. The profit motive. I I genuinely think that the profit motive in health care is a real problem because it's not optional, right? And, but like what you're talking about, like [00:24:00] the, the challenges of getting the, finding someone who has the care you need.
[00:24:04] Aicila: Like I, I You know, I had some stuff going on cognitively until the point that my kid talking to, um, she was talking to my, her husband and my other kid about planning for my eventual And I, and I went to, you know, and I went to several doctors over the course of a few years, and it turned out that I was B12 deficient. Uh, Due to the acid medication that I've been on for six years, which I was on because that caused, I had very bad acid reflux, it was, It's causing me genuine issues. And like now, six months later, so different. And it was B but, but the the symptoms that I had were extensive and scary. And I went to several doctors being like, I know something's wrong.
[00:24:53] Aicila: And I didn't know what. And finally I found a doctor who's a partner with me and was like, all right, we're going to figure this out. [00:25:00] And I was just like, that's great. I was prepared for things to be really bad.
[00:25:06] Krista: right. If you take something like nutrient deficiencies, I think that's really interesting because that's something that's sometimes really hard to get insurance to pay for testing. But it makes so much sense because all of those nutrients are building blocks, so when I do, I'll do a big nutrient panel with people and I explained to them.
[00:25:26] Krista: I said, it's about you can't make good chocolate chip cookies without enough chocolate chips, or sugar or butter, whatever it is. And if you can balance your body and balance yourselves by figuring out what's missing, because a nobody's diets perfect. B, even if your diet was perfect, are soils nutrient depleted?
[00:25:46] Krista: If you've been ill or had a baby or had stress that depletes things and that's something that you can really just turn a corner for a lot of people just by addressing deficiencies and the cognition is a big part of it. I [00:26:00] just, I think with mental health in general, I think if everybody could have a good nutrient panel, if we could rule out any infections that it would be, it would really change the way the
[00:26:11] Krista: world
[00:26:11] Krista: goes around.
[00:26:13] Aicila: But that doesn't make as much money for Yeah. And that,
[00:26:17] Aicila: that's the part where I think that understanding and I've, I mean, I pay some attention. I wouldn't say, um, you know, high level, but I, you know, I list, I take, but I didn't know that you could be not prescribing. Like That's messed
[00:26:32] Aicila: up.
[00:26:33] Krista: yeah, it's really, and those medications that they're recommending, they have side effects and some of them include like nutrient depletion, like your acid medicine. And what's crazy to me is going through school, going through continuing ed and stuff. They don't teach you like, Hey, your patients who take this medicine should supplement with B12.
[00:26:55] Krista: This person could become fully or magnesium deficient. And the one [00:27:00] place. That I remember taking one like continuing ed class where they did mention and I said, oh do you recommend All of your patients who are taking this medicine, take B12. And she said, oh no, just check them, treat it when it gets low.
[00:27:12] Krista: I'm like, What?
[00:27:14] Aicila: Yeah.
[00:27:15] Krista: That makes no sense. If somebody truly needs a medication, it's depleting a vital nutrient, but the, and I really do believe most people who practice have good intentions. They're doing the best that their training and experience has taught them. But there's a lot to be desired in that training, and there's become a really huge pushback against what we call nutraceuticals, using the nutrients to treat.
[00:27:43] Krista: And you'll hear really shoddy studies quoted about it's proven vitamin C can't help a cold or, and just throw things out. And they, what cracks me up is how, oh, they're always like, these vitamin companies are just trying to make money off of you. And this from the medical
[00:27:58] Krista: pharmaceutical [00:28:00] industry. It's yeah, some of them aren't very good, but you have to take something that's quality, that targets what you need, can be absorbed. They're not comparing, yeah, there's a big difference between the vitamin C you get at the Dollar Tree and the one you get maybe from your health food store that's absorbed.
[00:28:15] Krista: There's just so many factors that make it really shoddy science that we're completely willing to just throw at people. I remember asking one of our doctors once several years ago for my son to be tested for the MTHFR deficiency. It's like a genetic mutation that affects how your body can metabolize vitamins because my husband has it.
[00:28:39] Krista: It's associated with depression and he wouldn't do it. He said, it's not that big of a deal. He said, plus we're finding that like 25 percent of people have it. And I'm thinking 25 percent of people have diabetes. Do we say it's not a big deal because 25 percent of people have it? This is an easy fix!
[00:28:57] Krista: So
[00:28:58] Aicila: Yeah, [00:29:00]
[00:29:00] Krista: that's a whole rabbit
[00:29:00] Krista: hole of its own, but,
[00:29:02] Aicila: no, I appreciate it. It's It's hard. That's the I feel like there's genuine understandable frustrations on all sides and some of it you talked about earlier and I want to call back to is that as Modern people we believe we have the answers And I think we get pretty upset when we run into something and I, I'm not, I'm speaking obviously at a macro level, not you something like that, but, but we've gotten to this place of thinking.
[00:29:28] Aicila: We sort of know how things work and actually we don't. It's accept and say, like, even as a, as a doctor or nurse practitioner, even as a person educated and, you know, seeks out information. And, That we actually don't know, and therefore we have to be and it, you know, and I know there's a spectrum, but we do have to be open to taking in information and evaluating it as it comes in and understanding the body is very complex, like we can't assume and once again, like you said, circumstances also affect things.
[00:29:58] Aicila: And so that [00:30:00] curiosity of like, what's wrong? Why is it happening? How investigate this? It's, and trusting yourself,
[00:30:06] Krista: and knowing that just because they may not come to the right ultimate conclusion, what's most important is that they know something's wrong and they advocate for it. I think when people get in trouble is when they go and they say,
[00:30:20] Krista: I know this is wrong, because sometimes they're Right.
[00:30:24] Krista: but if it's more, if you know something's wrong, but one thing that I tell people to really be aware of, I have a list of what I call just BS diagnoses, which are code for we don't know what it is, so we'll call it this, and one of them, anxiety is a very real thing, but the number of people who have come to me with severe physical problems, and they say I've had everything checked out, it's anxiety, I need to work on anxiety, and I'm like, okay, There's the anxiety that starts in your head and there's goes to your body, but there's also the anxiety if something's wrong with your body That's a survival instinct.
[00:30:58] Krista: Anxiety tells you something's [00:31:00] wrong and you're unsettled and you have these physical symptoms because your body's teaching you something and to try to like Meditate away that or medicate away that is really unfair because I'm like maybe your heart Is racing erratically sometimes and you have headaches because
[00:31:19] Krista: Wrong
[00:31:20] Krista: and that's why you feel quote unquote anxious.
[00:31:23] Krista: I get really, mental health has always been really important to me, but I get really frustrated when I get the number of people who say I have all these physical problems and they've been basically told it's their fault.
[00:31:36] Aicila: Yeah.
[00:31:37] Krista: My daughter, when she first started, she started getting really severe migraines when she was 10.
[00:31:41] Krista: She missed almost two months of school. She was super, super sick. And then I ended up taking her to the ER once. This was about nine years ago, because she was seeing, she kept seeing red stuff. She's it's almost there's blood in the streets. And she, it was, and that's her, little girl way of [00:32:00] describing seeing something different.
[00:32:01] Krista: So we go to the ER because I'm thinking, what if there's a tumor? Usually with visual things. They called it a hallucination, which I don't think it was. I think it was her saying she saw colors, but there's something organic going on. So I'm like, what if my daughter is a brain tumor? She's had all these headaches.
[00:32:17] Krista: He spent maybe five minutes with me, walked out, came back five minutes later, said I talked to my attending and basically your daughter needs to see a psychiatrist. I said I have no issue with psychiatrists, but there's something wrong with her. This is very. And we had sought help for the anxiety, but again, then we go back and find out, wait a minute, she has all these infections and as we've treated them and treated some nutrient deficient she's doing so much better.
[00:32:47] Krista: And most of the anxiety she has now is because of the way she was treated about things when it started, the school saying, Oh, you're faking it, you're being dramatic. Just again, blaming. [00:33:00] Blaming the person who's sick. And that
[00:33:02] Aicila: Yeah. No, it really does. And I, I'm glad that, I, love that you're doing this. I, I hope. That this is more of a trend as I feel like and as you know I it's tricky there are also people who who will dismiss and and and I and I don't and I think that's part of it is that people need to feel that sense of Knowing that they need to trust themselves and then also I look at it as a as a Gordian knot because I'm like I get It like we want to have some Irregulation or oversight.
[00:33:43] Aicila: And yet the way that it's folded right now, it seems like there's a lot more profit motive than care for the person's long term. And to call back to what you said about nutrients, like I, I like to use herbs as a supplement and a, like, like a body support system [00:34:00] and I have to go and read, because regulated at all, so they could have like a drop of milk thistle in something, which has been proven to help with livers, but you can't just go buy have to look up and look who who processes it appropriately so it doesn't damage the plant, who gets it third party tested to make it has what it says it has in it. And there's like two or three companies that do that, but there's 30 companies on the shelf.
[00:34:25] Krista: good for you. But I think then the other side of that too is not then taking for granted if something is FDA approved. That everything's great about it, because if you, anyone in the public can prescribe to the FDA's newsletter, I think it's called MedWatch or something like that, where there's recalls all the time, for devices, drugs, things that are found to be contaminated, and so it is just being that wise consumer, and how do you have that healthy degree of skepticism without being paranoid, because that's not a good way to live either, that's [00:35:00] really, at a certain time you have to have you have to have some trust.
[00:35:04] Krista: You
[00:35:04] Aicila: Yeah,
[00:35:05] Krista: trust.
[00:35:06] Aicila: That balance of both is so, and it's, and why people don't do it. Like if you're exhausted or you're sick, so your, your mentality is, you know, you have cognitive issues or just frankly exhausted because there's too much to do in the day and you're just trying to survive.
[00:35:20] Krista: And then accepting to, we've, the number of kids I have and the sickness and all the years of stuff, we've got a lot of medical expenses.
[00:35:30] Krista: And realizing there's some things you can't cut corners on, like you mentioned the milk thistle, but like probiotics, if I have somebody who has to take or chooses to take antibiotics for a longer period of time if they have an infection that's taking a while to clear, there is not a cheap, high quality
[00:35:46] Krista: it doesn't exist. If you want a really good one, they cost more than I would like them to, and I'm not trying to, we, I hesitated for a while to carry supplements in our office because I didn't want to be like
[00:35:59] Krista: the [00:36:00] Salesperson ish thing here, but I realize a lot of people, because they're tired, just want you to say, here it is, take it home, so I always try to frame things like, This is what I recommend.
[00:36:10] Krista: You can buy it here. You can buy it somewhere else. But this is what I recommend and why these are some, we carry brands that I trust because I know that not all of them you're getting what,
[00:36:21] Krista: what's being advertised.
[00:36:22] Aicila: Yeah. And, and that's, honestly, like, that's what I want, like, I did a lot of research to find the healthcare provider that I did because I knew something was wrong and I was like, I can't figure the medical thing out, but I can to find somebody. And, And I look for stuff, I use health grades, for comments, like, that are different, one, there was one guy that had like 30 statements that were like, no, I don't trust that. but I look for comments, like, they they listened, they asked me questions. about things I wasn't expecting. They found something I didn't think like, I didn't know. Like, I look for that type of commentary. And there's usually not a lot. People don't do, leave a lot of [00:37:00] reviews for doctors. me, it was just like, I, I want someone that I know is curious and has the knowledge that you have, who's looking for the things Because I can't evaluate a medical study.
[00:37:09] Krista: And it's fine people come in and have read it because we have to do our own research and start someplace, but it's the willingness. of the consumer and the provider because both have to be willing to have a conversation, because you have to look for yourself and there's nothing wrong with using Google, as long as you're also willing to have a conversation about it and dig a little deep versus no, I believe nothing you said because this one article said that but I have to give grace to people because a lot of people have been burned by the medical system, they have reasons to be suspicious And that's
[00:37:42] Krista: fair. fair.
[00:37:44] Aicila: Yeah, right. exactly. And I bet that helps people to get into that place of trust and that made that once they trust you, they, then you can really have that
[00:37:53] Aicila: partnership. And, but it has to go both ways. You also have to, like you said, trust them to be able to tell you the truth about what's going [00:38:00] on and what they will actually do to address their issues.
[00:38:04] Krista: And coming to a place, too, where you're okay as a, in this case, a healthcare provider, but as a business owner in general that it's okay if you lose some people. You're going to lose some people, you're going to gain some people. You have to be, have that integrity. This is how we practice.
[00:38:23] Krista: This is why we do what we do. And it's okay if we're not for everyone. That's really okay. And it's okay, too, if somebody's not ready or willing to change or accept help, because what's the point of me pushing them if they're not in that cognitive or emotional place to make change?
[00:38:45] Krista: We're here if you change your mind or maybe they'll find someone else or something else or maybe they're not Able to take that step and that's okay. That's up to them
[00:38:53] Aicila: Right, exactly. Can you share or tell us, tell me about advice you've received that's influenced how you approach your [00:39:00] work?
[00:39:03] Krista: This is I remember I was taking it was a business coach when I was first doing What was starting up and I was talking to someone about pricing because that's something I've struggled with because I just you know I'd give it all away if I could and I had Tried to figure out what's the bare minimum I could charge people and survive and I remember someone saying Krista You've got to stop and look if you charge enough that you're making a profit Then you'll have more to give away like in reality what can help more people by charging a fair price and it's not exorbitant and they, there are people who have pushed back as we've had to raise our prices, but part of it's just because of the time we give.
[00:39:47] Krista: If you want a 15 minute appointment, you can go somewhere and get that. But all my appointments are at least a half hour. And then, if somebody wants more time, we do an hour or more appointment and it, you can't have it all. You [00:40:00] can't pay, a hundred bucks to sit with me for an hour, have my staff do all the follow up, chase down your lab it's not sustainable.
[00:40:07] Krista: I can't pay the bills and pay my staff and not be completely stressed. And so that, that's really helped me realize, if I'm, as long as I'm being fair it's okay to charge a fair price, make a profit, because ultimately you'll be able to help a lot more people that way. You'll
[00:40:24] Krista: have. A cushion so that if someone can't afford care, then you just say, you know what, don't worry
[00:40:29] Krista: about it. We'll take care of
[00:40:30] Aicila: Mm hmm. I worked with a community called the Post Growth Entrepreneurship Community and one of the things that the founder talks about is the difference between profit, which is the money you need that's additional to your income to kind of run your business and to have a cushion to invest and profit, which is what they call extractive profit that you pull out of the business so you could eventually build a spaceship
[00:40:54] Aicila: or whatever, .
. But actually, you know that what you're talking about is [00:41:00] We have to understand there's nothing wrong with people being successful , and financially viable and making a profit where it gets dicey is when , they take it out of the community , and they don't, they don't understand like that, that there's this whole group here that we're part of , and being more thoughtful of that. right?
[00:41:21] Krista: I want to attract and retain really good health care providers. We're never going to be able to pay someone's going to make I work in third shift at the hospital with shift differential, but if we have a comfortable profit and I can get my staff raises so that I keep really good people and I can help.
[00:41:37] Krista: One of the things I really like to invest in is their education so that we can do more continuing education, things grow, be a place that people want to work to. One of the things that I've prided myself in, it wasn't my intention, but I want this to be a really great place for moms to work because I am a mom, and so I tried very hard my [00:42:00] other moms who work here work part time to say, you have flexibility with your hours as long as you're consistent, these are the two days you can work.
[00:42:08] Krista: That's fine. Be here those two days if you can't come because there's emergency just communicate. It's fine. I don't want to be Crack the whip. These are the hours. I need you here and you are suffering because you're always gonna miss Johnny's baseball game or whatever it is, I want this to be a place where you can flourish professionally And still have quality time for your family where we can support you and you can support us and I remember when I went back for my nursing degree, I had already had another degree that was not.
[00:42:43] Krista: profitable at all. It made me employable. But I already had my son Daniel and I remember this one professor saying she thought the best employees were like part time nurses who were stay at home moms because they were so like committed [00:43:00] and focused when they were there because for
[00:43:02] Krista: them this was like a
[00:43:03] Krista: vacation.
[00:43:04] Aicila: No, it's true!
[00:43:05] Krista: true. If you're used to being home with kids and you're working a couple days a week like You are the best employee ever. You're not burnout because you're not there all the time. And as hard as it is, it's not as hard as wrangling little kids and keeping people alive and all of those emotional demands.
[00:43:23] Krista: So,
[00:43:24] Aicila: Yeah. , That's super, super wise. And I think the other thing is like the folks that I had to work with in general and this group that I was part of is it's folks that want to, they want to do their business. They're not building something in the hopes of winning the investment lottery. , this is actually what they want to do.
[00:43:41] Aicila: And so they see themselves as more in a partnership with their employees in a partnership with their community for whatever it is that they're creating and however big their community is.
[00:43:50] Krista: And that really is the beauty of entrepreneurship, even though it's something I really didn't think I would have ever have the guts to do. And there's a lot of. [00:44:00] There's some weight that comes with that, but the freedom of building something that you believe in and being able to serve people in a way that's meaningful to you, that, why would you not want to do it?
[00:44:12] Aicila: And, uh, and you're, you're in a profession that , can be very draining and exhausting. Can you talk a little bit about what you do to keep yourself inspired or how you recharge so that you can come back refreshed to do this?
[00:44:26] Krista: Yeah, so It's something I always struggle with because I, between the business, which a lot of weeks is 55 to 60 hours, and the kids, and there's, you really have to carve time for that. I would say the things that help me the most are habits that I've had for a while. My husband and I, for 27 years, we go on a date every week, period.
[00:44:48] Krista: My kids just know we do. The more time that I make to care for my physical health, the better. And even if it's in small segments, but my body and mind work better if I [00:45:00] take time to do even my 10 minute yoga or go on a walk or whatever it is. And then I, for me, a very big deal has been that I, I don't work on Sundays and it has been such a blessing because to have a day where I've chosen to leave work behind and say there's six other days to do this.
[00:45:19] Krista: This day is different. Mondays are the best day of the week because of that. And it really does help me to recharge. Because, yeah, I could, there's always stuff I could have done. It's not, I don't take a break on Sundays because everything's taken care of. But taking that purposeful space for things that are more important to me, with my faith and my family and just my health.
[00:45:45] Krista: Has really sustained me in unexpected ways. I've always enjoyed our Sabbath traditions, but with this job, because I do work six other days of the week pretty much all the time, even if I have a quote unquote day off, it's been very [00:46:00] sustaining and
[00:46:00] Krista: rejuvenating.
[00:46:07] Aicila: that sounds really wise and, and very refreshing. I feel that that Uh, so for folks that are listening or, you know, I know that you're more of a physical business, there's folks, you're in Ohio, right? Like That are like, Hey, I need that.
[00:46:24] Aicila: Or you,
[00:46:25] Aicila: how do they find you follow your
[00:46:27] Aicila: company, get in touch.
[00:46:29] Krista: You have a license in? Yeah. We're working on getting licensed in some other states for telehealth, but really if you go to our website, which is a hp clinic.com, you can reach out there. We are working on. Getting a blog up when, so if you go there now, there'll be nothing there, but I've purchased the domain so that maybe saying this on air will motivate me because I have a son who's helping me now, but it's made to be whole.
[00:46:56] Krista: com so made number to be [00:47:00] whole. com and hopefully a podcast in the next year.
[00:47:05] Aicila: Nice. Well, If you need support on that, talk to me,
[00:47:10] Aicila: because I love podcasts.
[00:47:11] Aicila: And thank you everybody for listening and I really appreciate you taking your time this morning Krista. It was so great to catch up with you .
